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Is Elizabeth Johnson a sign of the times? Mother of Gabriel Johnson’s jailhouse interview

January 12, 2010

The Gabriel Johnson case is getting more bizarre by the minute.  CBS News 5, KPHO.com,  recorded a 4 way interview between Elizabeth Johnson,  Tammi & Jack Smith, the couple that attempted to adopt Gabriel, and a reporter.

LINK to the full interview (audio)

It was a deja-vu moment.  I felt like I should be hearing strains from the theme song to the old Twilight Zone TV series. (“doodoo-doodoo, doodoo-doodoo–well, you get the picture.)

Elizabeth Johnson  could be Casey Anthony’s double.  Not physically, of course, although both women are attractive, but in her demeanor.  Her voice revealed no emotion whatsoever, not even for herself.   This woman didn’t even pretend to feign concern over her baby’s  fate.  And, like Casey, she never once called Gabriel by his name, instead repeatedly referred to him as “that child”.

It was clear by the tone of her voice that she did not feel she was to blame for anything. Logan McQueary, Gabriel’s father, “made” her react the way she did.  Logan “ruined her life and pushed her to run away.”  SHE didn’t do anything wrong,  and she had no clue why everyone was in an uproar about the fact that she first said she killed Gabriel, and later said she gave him to strangers in a park in Texas and had no knowledge of what those strangers did with him.

She insinuated that even though LE and the FBI said she was not cooperating, she had, in fact, cooperated fully.  The proof of that was in the fact that she talked to the FBI agents  til “3:00 in the morning” for goodness sake!   She did not seem to understand why or even how deeply in trouble she is.

A few excerpts from the interview are below.  The reporter, apparently not believing what he was hearing, repeatedly asked her if she understood the implications of what she was saying.

————————————————————————–

Reporter: How can you be sure your baby is alive?

Elizabeth: Uh, because when I left him with these people.  I trusted them.

Reporter: Why?

Elizabeth: What do you mean,  “why?”

I believed in my heart that they were good people……..

They reached out to me and seemed like they cared.

I met them in San Antonio.

They approached me.  I was out alone with the baby at the park.  I was upset.  I was crying. I’d been approached before in the same situation with Tammi.

Tammi: That’s how we met in– what do you call it– the airport.

Elizabeth said she didn’t understand why giving the baby to the couple in the park was any different than when she gave the baby to Tammi and Jack Smith, who she met in an airport.  She was crying both times, and she was approached by the people in the park the same way she was approached by the Smiths’.  They wanted to help her She was in distress.(Clear as mud, people!)

The reporter asked Elizabeth if  it really made any sense in her own mind for a normal mother to hand over her baby to perfect strangers.  She said, “yes”, because she had done it before and was praised for doing it! (referring to when she gave the baby to the Smiths’ although I’m not clear on who it was that was praising her.)

The reporter continued.

Reporter: In other words, you really don’t know if your son is alive or not?

Elizabeth: (after a long pause) Um, I know that he is.  I believe that he is.

Reporter: How?

Elizabeth: I mean, I’m in jail.  How could I know anything?

Reporter: Do you understand how serious this is that right now, because you said you killed your son….You are telling us now that you don’t know who has him or where he is.  Do you know how serious this looks against you?

Elizabeth: I really don’t.  I did the same thing with giving the baby away to Tammi….

Reporter: You REALLY don’t understand?….

Elizabeth: I mean, when you give up your child for adoption you don’t really know where the people live or anything.

The reporter went on to ask why she didn’t just take the baby to a police station or call the Smiths’  to tell them she couldn’t handle it.  She replied that she DID think about doing those things, but she was afraid she would be arrested for kidnapping.

Tammi: Who told you that?

Elizabeth: (with a hint of a nervous giggle)  Logan.

Tammi: So, basically you were on the ledge and Logan pushed you off?”

Elizabeth: Yes.

Elizabeth  went on to say Logan was a terrible person and she didn’t believe he cared.  She didn’t want“the child” to be in an ugly custody dispute. He was going to make “the child” miserable and everyone around “the mother–me”, miserable.

Reporter: You really felt like it was alright to give your baby away to perfect strangers?

Elizabeth: I did.

Jack: Long and short of this whole thing. Without the baby–because of what you said, there is no reason for anybody to believe that you haven’t taken the baby’s life.  It’s important that you understand. It seems like you are not getting the picture….You understand you will be charged with this?

Elizabeth: Charged with what?

Tammi: For murder.

Reporter: Are you comfortable with the fact you may never see your kid again?

Elizabeth: No,  I’m not comfortable with that.  But, that’s a decision you make when you give up your child.

Reporter: What do you want them (the people that supposedly have Logan) to know.  Should they turn the baby over to the police?

Elizabeth: Um, obviously, yes.

An aside: How did they manage to get this particular interview in the first place?  I guess she wasn’t lawyered up yet. And how is it that another seemingly not too bright young woman held out against  the seasoned FBI agents that questioned her when she was arrested? They apparently didn’t get anywhere with her since Gabriel is still missing.

——————————————————————————————–

LINK to the full CBS-5 interview (audio)

———————————————————————————

There are a lot of questionable things going on in this case.  All of the people involved seem a little “off”, but this interview is literally over the top. I don’t get any sense from her conversation that she is mentally impaired.  So, is this some kind of hoax?  Is she punishing Gabriel’s dad?  Is she lying about what happened to the baby as her grandfather has stated publicly? Are Tammi and Jack Smith telling the truth when they say they don’t know what happened to Gabriel?  Their respective lie detector tests came back “inconclusive”.  Does Elizabeth think this is a game of will, and when Logan gives in to her demand that the Smiths’ adopt Gabriel, he will effectively be crying “uncle”, and then and only then will she produce the baby?  Does she, as the police and Gabriel’s father think, know where the baby is and that he is okay?  Or, was her original text to Logan the real truth–She killed Gabriel, stuffed him in a diaper bag, and tossed him in a dumpster?

Here’s the bigger question. Is there a new breed of Casey Anthony copycats starting to make their presence known?  Is there a whole generation of innocent babies being born that will be exposed to this not so “clear” but very “present” danger?

I don’t believe that people like Elizabeth Johnson, or Casey Anthony, or even a Misty Croslin just happen out of the blue.  I believe they have been sending out signals their whole lives–signals that have been patently ignored, swept under the table, or explained away as immaturity by family and friends. The violence they are capable of is grievously underestimated by everyone.  How many women like them are out there, slipping under the radar, simmering on a back burner, just waiting for the right trigger–a trigger that will mean the end of a beautiful child’s life and the beginning of an unbearable and unthinkable tragedy for everyone around them?  Too many to count, I fear. I’m starting to think this is just the tip of the iceburg, and if that’s the case, God help us all.


111 Comments leave one →
  1. Mary permalink
    January 12, 2010 3:53 pm

    I’m really not sure about Tammi..JMO.. I thought she was trying to put words in Elizabeth’s mouth for her.. Seems like another Cindy to me wanting to run the show, but not as aggressive..hmmm

  2. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 12, 2010 4:11 pm

    Hi Mary

    I agree with you. There’s something odd about Tammi and Jack if you’ve seen them in television interviews. Never mind that these two were going to adopt a baby from a distraught women they met in an airport? Something very strange about it.

  3. Boston permalink
    January 12, 2010 4:12 pm

    Hi Mystery- Great article. Thank you for the link to the interview.

    I think that the criminal justice system is arresting and charging more young men and woman for crimes against children and we are getting an up close and personal look at who these young people are and an almost instantaneous look at their backgrounds and those that insinuate themselves into the drama. Again, we don’t have a young mother talking to LE but would-be adoptive parents who are willing and able to discuss the disappearance of this precious child after having spent a week with him without the mother.

    Who does that kind of thing? Who are these people? Why in the name of all that is right and just did Mr and Mrs Smith not call the police and report a young mother who appeared depressed and wanted to give up her newborn? They should never have negotiated an adoption with someone who was so depressed and unstable and instead should have contacted CPS for help. What about the police?

    I think we are either seeing more untreated post partem depression, more mothers without support or interest in being a parent, possibly a young mother whose mental health issues were apparently overlooked during pregnancy, or perhaps the emergence of young sociopaths who just happen to be mothers.

  4. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 12, 2010 4:20 pm

    Boston–

    I also wonder why the Smiths’ were willing to go along with this in the first place. There’s so much we don’t know yet in this case–like, if the Smiths’ had the baby for 9 days–why and when did they give him back? Why didn’t anyone wonder where Gabriel was for that length of the time? When Elizabeth tore Logan’s house apart and threatened Gabriel the first time, why wasn’t child services brought in and the child removed from the home? Lots more questions than answers here, and sadly another child seems to be suffering the consequences of adults who chose to not “see” what was going on.

  5. stephanie permalink
    January 12, 2010 4:23 pm

    Hi Mystery…Great Post! I do believe Elizabeth was punishing Logan…He is the only person in this case that has shown any emotion.
    As far as the Smith’s…they need to go away. I don’t trust them at all…they went from slamming Logan to now they are victims and she lied. Did they think of checking any of this out before they took as far as they did? I also do think they know something…Mark Klass stated the other night they have contradictions in many things they say. I didn’t pay attention as much until he said that. They are small but important, imo. Plus if they loved this child that is missing…How come they continue to be all smiley face on TV? I don’t like or trust them.
    You know I bet she wasn’t even really crying at the airport…this was just a manipulative move on her part. I do pray she was doing her manipulative at a park here in Texas…Than baby Gabriel has a better chance of being found alive.

  6. stephanie permalink
    January 12, 2010 4:28 pm

    Mystery…If I remember correctly they drew up some kind of guardian papers. She was hiding him from Logan. I don’t know if it was LE that went over to their house because Logan called them (another situation show me he is okay). Or if it was the court sending them over because of the joint custody. However, they showed LE some papers that now LE doesn’t know that they were really through the court papers…they didn’t look close enough.
    I know before LE said publicly they don’t know if they were court issued guardianship papers…I thought they couldn’t have real papers because Logan wanted his child.

  7. Boston permalink
    January 12, 2010 4:59 pm

    Adoption takes place in a courtroom. All the interviews are done and background checks are made and the entire process can take up to and including two or more years. Even when it is a “private” adoption court records are established and all parties to the adoption go through exhaustive criminal, psychological background checks, financial records are reviewed, child and maternal health records are also part of the review. The vetting process for adoption is probably more exhaustive and invasive than that which is done for those who run for public office. No one enters into these negotiations upon arrival at an airport to suddenly meet a random mother who wants to surrender her child. Mr and Mrs Smith should have called the police to report a mother who was in distress. Now look what happened.

  8. GasCanGeorgelovesbling permalink
    January 12, 2010 6:07 pm

    Where’s George Anthony?

  9. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 12, 2010 6:36 pm

    Hi Stephanie–

    Do you remember reading about a dad(can’t remember the name) who’s son was taken out of the country by the mother (who later died)? The mother showed false or old custody papers (the dad had current custody)to the court and the court took her at her word. (Unbelievable!) The family of the woman then tried to keep the dad from the son. He recently got custody and was supposed to get his son back right before Christmas. My point is that apparently it’s not all that uncommon for courts or police to be shown “official looking” papers and not checking it out. That needs to change, IMO. Not enough people that can make a difference “looking close enough.”

    I think the Smiths’ are very suspect. Both of them scored an “inconclusive” on their polys? If they are telling the truth shouldn’t at least one of them have passed?

    The Smiths’ have said that they only recently met Elizabeth and Gabriel. They were with Gabriel only for a brief amount of time. I would like to know more about their backgrounds. Were they looking to adopt a baby when they happened upon a distraught Elizabeth at the airport?

    Again, way more questions than answers at this point.

  10. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 12, 2010 6:53 pm

    Boston

    You are absolutely correct. Adoption is a serious business, and you better not have any secrets. Not only is it a long process, it is a an even longer process after the baby is matched to his/her new family. The adoption isn’t finalized for a year after the child moves in with the adoptive parents.

  11. stephanie permalink
    January 12, 2010 6:57 pm

    Mystery…to add to that story recently there was one down here in Texas. The South end of Texas. A mother had custody of her child…the father took custody papers to court and showed the judge. He had a police escort to pick his child up off the bus. The boy cried and cried begging not to send him with his father. I can’t remember now if the mom made it there are not, but LE let the father take him. Mind you the mother moved there to be safe from her x taking the son again.
    Well they discovered the papers were a warrant for the father written in Spanish and they had nobody to translate at the time and took the father’s word for it. They don’t know where he is now…thinking Russia. I believe but not positive his new wife/girlfriend is Russian.

    As you say way more questions than answers.

  12. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 12, 2010 6:59 pm

    Here’s a scary thought. If Elizabeth really did give her baby to complete strangers in San Antonio, those people must realize that this case is all over the news. Why haven’t they taken Gabriel to the nearest police station? Why didn’t they turn him over to authorities in the first place?

  13. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 12, 2010 7:02 pm

    stephanie–

    I remember that and may be mixing that case up with the guy who just got custody back after his ex-wife died.

    The trouble with following all of these cases is that they flare up and quickly lose the media’s interest. It’s difficult to find out what happened or what is happening once they stop making the papers. Caylee’s case is an exception to the rule and has a lot to do with the Sunshine laws in Florida.

  14. stephanie permalink
    January 12, 2010 7:36 pm

    I thought about that too Mystery…Why haven’t these adoptive parents come forward that she gave Gabriel too? That is scary…I also thought maybe because he wasn’t adopted out, but given to someone for this underground safe house. Often in those situations a person(like the Smith’s) aren’t given all the info in case LE gets involved. The third scenario is what I don’t want to think about…She did murder Gabriel.

    I think along with the Sunshine laws…the characters in Caylee’s case had a lot to do with it.

  15. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 12, 2010 8:13 pm

    Stephanie–

    I hadn’t even thought abut a safe house situation, but even if that were the case, I would think they would have “seen the light” by now. I don’t want to think about the alternative either.

    Yes, the characters in Caylee’s case added to the media frenzy.

  16. pak31 permalink
    January 12, 2010 9:01 pm

    There is something very vague about this whole story. We know the jist of it but there are missing spots. I am confused. Not all full info is being relayed here. Was the adoption by the Smiths, being done legitimately through the courts?? A caller to Nancy Grace’s show brought up a good point, she(the caller) said she wouldn’t go up to someone in distress with their child and offer to adopt them. That whole story seems strange to me too. Plus, tammy only knew Elizabeth for like 4 weeks??? The guest on NG told the SMiths to retake the polygraph because for both of them to fail is odd and the fact that tammy used Gabriel in the past tense was a red flag. I think that these people might have something to do with G or know something. The whole adoption thing is odd.

  17. pak31 permalink
    January 12, 2010 9:09 pm

    I just want to add, Mystery, that your thoughts are very insightful. This girl, as I heard in that interview above, acts like she ditched a pencil. SHe has no emotion toward her son. There is no attachment, no love, no bond, nothing. She just wanted to rid herself of him and move on. Now she’s like” what is the big deal?”.

  18. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 12, 2010 9:33 pm

    pak

    I’m watching NG right now, and for some reason she doesn’t question the Smiths motives and defends them. Not sure what that’s about. They are talking about GPS evidence right now–that Elizabeth had a GPS device in her car and she left it there when she abandoned it. Authorities are using it to track her movements in San Antonio. That’s encouraging news to me. Maybe they’ll find where she left him-hopefully alive.

    They need to throw the book at this freak.

  19. Boston permalink
    January 12, 2010 9:46 pm

    Stephanie-The case you are referring to is the Lancome boy whose father took him to Europe (Russia or France). It might be the cosmetic company fortune that he lives on. The Judge had interpreters in his courthouse employ to the best of my recollection and did not call upon them to verify what was presented to the judge. The docs were apparently bogus. The poor mother is so distraught and the son complained about being hit and mistreated. Like all these abduction and custody battles that one was particularly painful to read about. The interview on HLN with Mike Galanos was heartbreaking.

    Steph, Mystery and Pak31 my “psychic” vibe tells me that possibly this child is alive. If she is lying than she is one cool character. Casey’s twin? Well, it could be true. Couldn’t they have been born on that parallel universe Len Padilla talks about?

    Did you think the comment made by the father to the media was errily similar to one of Cindy’s comments early on in the investigation? The grandfather seems as unmoved as Ms Elizabeth.

    Thanks for clearing that up, Boston!

    I hope your crystal ball doesn’t lie, Boston. I pray this little boy is very much alive. My little grandson isn’t a lot older than Gabriel. Something about that little boy reminds me of my own, and I can’t get him out of my mind.

    I think there is a lot about this case that is shades of Casey Anthony. Logan appears to be an enabler just like Cindy.

  20. sophie permalink
    January 12, 2010 10:34 pm

    You know, it used to be 20 or so years ago, that if a girl got pregnant with an unwanted child, she just went to a doctor and had an abortion. 30 or 40 years ago, they ‘went to Aunt Martha’s’ for a few months and came back empty handed, or just in time for their parents to suddenly adopt a new baby.

    You either ‘never’ had a child, or you became the ‘sister’ of your child, or you aborted your child. And while the latter is considered murder in the minds of many, it is no longer so in the eyes of the law.

    Now it seem to be, if you don’t want your baby, you just copy Casey Anthony, being smart enough not to make the same mistakes she made; i.e. dumping the body off in your own neighborhood.

    If you don’t want the child, either go to Planned Parenthood so they can hook you up with adoption resources, or a doctor to end the pregnancy. Oh my God I cannot believe how lazy these girls are, to not bother doing anything to prevent a pregnancy, or end it if unwanted, or set it up for adoption, or for Christ’s sake, leave it with the fire department, police or hospital.

    Don’t these girls have a brain in their heads? Murder=prison. Doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure it out.

    Looks like this gal did the baby in to get back at the father AND thought she wouldn’t get caught because she traveled out of her area (not in her neighborhood) to get rid of the body and of course, instead of a phony nanny who took the child, it’s phony adoptive parents.

    Hi sophie–back then it was not acceptable to have a child “out of wedlock”. I mean really not acceptable as in you would be ostracized. Now it’s no big deal–and if we are to believe the rag shows, some girls even go out of their way to get pregnant. They romanticize the whole thing. Of course, they have no idea the responsibility and work involved and more often than not, the grandparents end up raising the kids or they end up on welfare, neglected or worse, abused. I’m sure women murdered their children “back in the day” but at the rate it is happening today? I don’t know. Maybe, and we just never heard about it because it was swept under the carpet. Unless someone reports a child gone, how would anyone ever know?

  21. ???MAND permalink
    January 13, 2010 1:03 am

    The Smiths have an adopted daughter…it would be interesting to know if this was a traditional adoption…or did they think they could bypass all those rules and find a single Mother they might be able to talk into letting them adopt her baby…I heard Jack Smith talking about a private adoption…that was his term for this. Tammi keeps saying she had only known E. a very short time yet she says she had met her in the airport 7 months ago…what kind of contact have they had in the past 7 months? E. had their phone # and address… but can’t remember anything about this other couple she turned Gabriel over to….this case is full of twists and turns.

    I’d like to know more about that adoption as well, mand. It’s my understanding that a private adoption is actually more expensive and there is a lot more court time than in a traditional adoption.

    Now that we know that Tammi’s first cousin has been named as a possible father of Gabriel by Elizabeth on some court papers, this thing has really gotten bizarre. Lots of contradictions on her part.

  22. Renee permalink
    January 13, 2010 3:07 am

    new information. Now it is really getting weird and more obvious that something is not right with the Smiths.

    http://www.kpho.com/news/22222086/detail.html

    thanks for the link, Renee. Chad says he never heard of Elizabeth–Tammi says she mentioned months ago that her cousin Chad had a similar background to Logan’s–and Elizabeth, on her own, decides to put Chad–who she has supposedly never met–as a possible father to Gabriel?? What’s really going on here????

  23. stephanie permalink
    January 13, 2010 6:02 am

    Here is the link from NG last week. I was thinking all day if others were helping like an underground place because in the Smith’s interviews…They are so relaxed. I don’t understand how you can be relaxed with any child/baby missing. Much less a child you were adopting. Anyhow I was thinking about this all day on Friday. Than I see on NG Tammi wrote about an underground safe house for Elizabeth.

    Here is what Mark Klass had to say…I also believe he is right.

    MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: Well, I mean, you know, there are inconsistencies that are even showing this evening, Jean. On the posting on Facebook it`s dated the 23rd of December, yet she told you just a few minutes ago that the first time the word “underground” was mentioned was on the 26th of December.

    I don`t see how that works. She said, I don`t want to trash Logan, and then she spent two minutes trashing Logan. She said in that same posting, we don`t want to be part of — we don`t want to be in the middle of this.

    Well, it`s two weeks later. They`re not only in the middle of it but they keep coming up with new information that they seem to have forgotten to tell this person, that person, or the other person, and they`re begging to be polygraphed by law enforcement.

    I don`t understand why the Smiths are still involved in this story. If they have nothing to do with anything, they should have been able to simply tell the authorities what they know and extricate themselves from it and we possibly wouldn`t be going through what we`re going through what we`re going through this evening.

    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1001/08/ng.01.html

    Boston…You are right, the papers were bogus, written in Spanish and it was a warrant for the dad. The father having all that money is going to make it even tougher for the mom to find her son. She did everything right and the courts/LE did everything wrong.

    Hi Mand…I would like to know all about their other adoption too.

    That’s interesting, stephanie. I know the underground is coming up a lot now. My question would be why, at this point, hasn’t someone dropped him off at a police station? I think it’s pretty apparent that Elizabeth–not Logan had the problem. (at least from the information that has been released.

    Thanks for the transcript. NG tonight is saying that Elizabeth has given a description of the people she gave her son to, and has said that the FBI has a video of the them with Gabriel. Hope so. I hope this ends very soon.

  24. Hadley permalink
    January 13, 2010 6:52 am

    Hi Mystery,
    Just the fact that the Smiths “just happened” to be adoptive parents, and Elizabeth “chose them” out of ALL the people in the airport, seems very, very odd to me. Surely, other people were concerned about this crying Mother. It sounds like the Smiths were awaiting her arrival. IMO the Smiths know much, much more. They are lying.

    Good point, Hadley. I think they are lying as well and I find their story of how they met Elizabeth very suspect.

  25. Boston permalink
    January 13, 2010 7:51 am

    Stephanie-Your post is very, very interesting. I really respect and hold Mark Klass in high regard. His comments were very enlightening. I have to admit that I haven’t really gotten my head into this case yet because but I will read your link. Renee’s too.

    Sophie-Isn’t it strange that they have no ability to throw themselves on the “mercy of the court” so to speak or even realize any other alternatives to solving a problem or coming to some lawful resolution.

  26. Boston permalink
    January 13, 2010 7:57 am

    Renee provided a short article from Tempe, Az. Lots of little tidbits of information about why Mr and Mrs Smith remain persons of interest. . Hadley, I think it will answer some of your questions and mine as well.

    I agree, Boston. Renee’s link is worth a read. A lot of questions answered (but not enough)
    Here’s the link she provided again.

    http://www.kpho.com/news/22222086/detail.html

  27. Ideas permalink
    January 13, 2010 9:13 am

    I’m sure everything will come out in the wash.

    This sounds like a messy situation all around. We don’t even know that much about Logan. But it’s obvious Elizabeth is telling horrid things about him. If there are people who have her child, and they believe what she’s said about Logan, and they want to keep the baby, they would have to keep him a secret.

    Adoption is a wonderful solution, but it can be complicated, and some don’t trust it, just like there is a lot of distrust in the courts over custody arrangements.

    As far as bad parenting being a sign of the times, there have always been bad parents. Some have said legalizing abortion has de-valued the baby, made him disposable, and this attitude then permeates other living, surviving children when the parents are having a hard time.

    However, whether abortion is a culprit or not, there will always be selfish, troubled people who can do the unthinkable under the wrong circumstances.

    Hi ideas

    Is Elizabeth telling the truth–or is Logan? Here’s a link that shows photos of the weapons and apartment that Logan said Elizabeth ransacked. If this is true, this young woman has some major issues with anger.

    Starts with photo #7
    http://www.cbsnews.com/elements/2010/01/06/crimesider/photoessay6063007_1_7_photo.shtml?tag=page

    You are right. There always has been and will always be bad parents that hurt or murder their children. We just hear about it more now.

  28. Spacely permalink
    January 13, 2010 9:21 am

    Great comments from everyone!

    The Smiths are slimier than the Milsteads. Nothing about their story adds up. They keep saying they are telling the same story, yet just like Misty Croslin, the story is never the same.

    I have been watching Mark Klaas comment about these types of cases for well over a year now and he strikes me as a shrewd judge of character. He seems genuine in his purpose of helping the victimized child in all such cases regardless of the consequences to the adults involved because they can take care of themselves, just like Tim Miller. It seems over the last couple of days, his commentary directly about the Smiths has been toned down by Nancy Grace, who I believe is doing America a disservice by accepting the Smiths at their word. However, she does tend to always treat a guest who is regularly appearing on her show in this manner, ie Ron Cummings.

    Who would take a baby they are not related to and don’t really know the mother for more than a week? That is not an act of kindness. One day is an act of kindness. If it was for a friend. And the child appeared healthy and to be returning to a healthy environment. But for more than a week? With no attempt to secure through the proper authorities the future of this child you claim to love? And then to take advantage of the obvious emotional distress and imbalance of a mother who is basically a child herself and breaking down in hysterics in public to further your own personal desires? Isn’t that what Kidfinders and Dennis and Sherri Milstead do?

    Elizabeth = KC = Misty

    The parallels in the three cases are astounding.

    As much as I want to, I can’t bring myself to believe in a fictional set of adoptive parents or a safehouse, just like I can’t believe in a fictional nanny or a fictional stranger dressed in black.

    I can’t understand how LE can be stopped cold in their tracks by the insertion of fake people and incidents into a suspect’s story. Technically, LE failed to solve the Caylee case because they did not find the body, a citizen stumbled on it. LE has miserably failed Haleigh. They are not doing so hot on this one either.

    Good points all, Spacely. The answer is that of course no one in their right mind would just accept a baby that was handed to them. They would go to the authorities. Somethin’ way not right with all these people. It is shades of the Milsteads.

    I think LE has an obligation to check out every lead, every story, every morsel of information whether they believe it to be true or not. Yes, it slows things down, but it is a necessary part of our justice system. That said, I think the situation with Haleigh is that that whole county is corrupt. LE, as well as the people that know the truth, and I believe there are several, has definitely failed her.

    I hope you are wrong. I hope Gabriel is alive, but….

  29. Boston permalink
    January 13, 2010 9:40 am

    Spacely, I agree with you on all points with the exception of one: “LE failed to find the body”. I would say that it was more important to recognize that the body was found and by a Good Samaritan. Had they never found the body nothing much would have changed but the initial charges would have been upgraded to Felony Murder in the absence of a body.

    I have a lot of respect and admiration for every LE agency that did their utmost to find this child. Casey Anthony was charged and remanded to the Orlando Jail within 48 hours of the initial call to the OCSD. They knew the child was deceased (Yuri stated this at the Bond hearing) but it was almost “a given” once authorities went to the “crime scene” (the car) that much more than an abduction/kidnapping took place. Florida LE has a world class reputation and sets the standards for many local and municipal police forces across the country.

    It is easy to play the blame game but at the end of the day it will always be the person who admits to being the last person to see the victim alive who disrupts and derails any murder investigation.

    I think it was an absolute miracle that someone found Caylee. Searching for her was literally like searching for a needle in a haystack. Thanks to Caylee’s so-called family LE’s job was made doubly hard. I do believe that there will be justice for Caylee.

    The last person to see the victim alive other than Casey? That would be George.

  30. Hilde permalink
    January 13, 2010 9:44 am

    I have been following Baby Gabriel’s story from the Beginning. I hope and pray this beautiful Baby is still alive. At this time I really don’t know what to think yet.
    In so many Ways Elizabeth’s Story just doesn’t seem to add up and has a lot of Similarities with Casey Anthony. Casey also wouldn’t help the Authorities to find Caylee just like Elizabeth.
    The only Difference between Casey and Elizabeth is, with Casey it really was very obvious Caylee wasn’t going to be found alive and Casey had something to do with it, especially when the Evidence came out that there was a dead Body in Casey’s Trunk.
    In little Gabriel’s Case I believe there could be a Chance he still can be found alive, at the same time I do have kind of a sick Feeling maybe that is just a wishful thinking on my Part.
    I don’t know enough to make up my mind in this Case, everything sounds so bizarre. The Smith’s don’t make much Sense either, don’t know if You can believe what they are saying.
    I just don’t understand how a Mother can put her own precious Child in such an uncertain Situation which might not end very well. Could Elizabeth have killed her precious little Boy, I guess it is possible, I just don’t get it anymore.
    We don’t really know what went on between Logan and Elizabeth, one thing is clear another innocent Child has to pay the Price of the Actions of Adults in it’s Life which should be loving and caring for that little Boy instead Gabriel is being used as a Bargain Chip between those two, especially by his Mother.
    How in the World can Elizabeth live with herself knowing she gave up her Baby out of her selfish Reasons. I am sorry I just don’t get it any more.
    I hope and pray they will be able to find Baby Gabriel and he will be put in the Care of someone who really can take care of this precious little Boy and love him unconditional and keep him save. JMO

    Hi Hilde–Tonight on NG, Tammi said she has been back to the jail and talked with Elizabeth again. Elizabeth is saying there is video of the couple she gave the baby to and that the FBI has it. If that’s true, then her story is much more likely to be true and Gabriel may very well be alive. If it’s true that a couple in Texas took the baby then why haven’t they brought him back at this point? The story is all over the news. There’s no way they wouldn’t have heard about it. That leaves a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach.

  31. Spacely permalink
    January 13, 2010 11:57 am

    Boston,

    Your point about the body being found being the important thing is valid, but I have to disagree about the importance of the body and the efforts of LE to locate Caylee.

    Caylee’s final location was revealed within the first week of the investigation by a former neighborhood girlfriend of KC. The first time I ever read her interview, I immediately keyed in on the location and I am merely a follower from afar. I had assumed it had been quickly checked. It has always boggled my mind that no one searched that location within a few days of the interview, especially since the location was so near the house. In LE’s defense, the interview was conducted by one of the detectives further down the command chain and with the amount of information coming in, perhaps it was overlooked. But overlooking key items does not make a successful investigation. Yes, the area was probably underwater, but why was it not being monitored and scheduled for a search upon draining?

    At the time Caylee’s remains were found, the police had given up the search.

    The body is key to the entire case. Everything has changed because the body was found. Without the body, the state’s case was extremely flimsy, which is why Jose was happy smiley in all his interviews back then. Everything was going the way of the defense without the body, despite the circumstancial evidence. The medical examiner declaring the death a homicide allowed the prosecution to put the Death Penalty back on the table. The timetables of the estimated time the body was in the location ties back to the time the car was still in KC’s possesion. The duct tape and other physical evidence collected at the scene points to intentional murder in a despicable, perhaps painful, fashion. The complete lack of evidence with the body identifying anyone other than KC furthers the state’s case. I believe the body to be the key to convicting KC and punishing her with at least life in prison.

    It’s wonderful that a Good Samaritan did find her and that is indeed a blessing. But we didn’t reach that point because of good police work. In fact, it appears we got there despite poor police work when you consider the interview, the lack of an intial police search of the area, the further lack of police follow-up when the area drained, and the actions of the deputy who responded to Kronk’s August calls. It is even possible that because of these poor LE actions, the case has been compromised by allowing enough doubt about Kronk’s intentions to blossom that the defense is able to attack his motives and refocus the case away from KC.

  32. Boston permalink
    January 13, 2010 1:01 pm

    Spacely-You are 100% right. I also read that report of Kiomarie sitting in the patrol car telling one of the investigators about her childhood friend Casey and where they used to hang out and what they did there. I was so surprised that no one has ever discussed the early tell-tale signs of sociopathy (harming animals). Kiomarie went ahead and sold her story to the National Inquirer. I also remember quite clearly how many posters on this Blog teased one another when Mystery brought this article up for discussion. You are so right on.

    Another important point that I probably never thought of was the fact that the search for either a “live” Caylee or her remains was not a part of the equation come December. Even Mr Baez felt comfortable on December 9, 2008 that “Caylee was alive”. You have put forward a cogent, careful and factual account of how and why finding the body was central to this particular case. I stand corrected.

    Would it be fair to say that when the DA put the DP on the table in November that he had substantial circumstantial evidence of premeditation? Am I correct in assuming it is circumstantial and not direct? What prompted him other than the forensic evidence coming from the computer searches, chorloform/hair samples to convince him to charge her with Felony Murder in the First Degree if he did not think HAC’s were involved? Do you think that when he offered limited immunity that he was hoping to have questions answered in a “backwards sort of way”?

    All the evidence in this case is circumstantial if I understand the term correctly.

    Direct Evidence
    Facts proven by witnesses who personally saw deeds or heard words spoken which constitute irrefutable proof. (from my handy dandy Dictionary of Legal Terms at the top of this page 😆 )

  33. Hadley permalink
    January 13, 2010 1:01 pm

    Mystery,
    My gut feelings tell me that the Smiths were “waiting” for Gabriel and his Mother to arrive, and it was not just by chance that they were there. They have one adopted child, and wanted another. They found out little Gabriel was “available” and took it from there. I strongly believe that they know where this beautiful child is, and even planned a place to put him in the event something like this happened. I truly believe that they are lying, and I just pray that the second polygraph will prove that. It’s so obvious, to me, that they know something. Who knows, Gabriel could be in Mexico, and they plan to move there at a later time.(I think it’s too late for that tho! They will have to make other plans!)

    Hadley, tonight I heard Tammi tell NG that although she met Elizabeth at the airport, it was 7 months later when they attempted to adopt him. Who knows if that is true or not–there have been so many twists and turns in this case. At this point I would be glad to know they have him stashed somewhere. That would be better than the alternative.

  34. Hadley permalink
    January 13, 2010 1:19 pm

    Mystery,
    I’m sorry, I seem to be repeating myself. This case really breaks my heart, and I just can’t bare the thought that someone is hurting this adorable baby. I am still stunned that no one from LE/FBI cannot make the mother talk! I thought (especially the FBI) had specially trained people that could do this! What a disappointment! Bet if she lived in Iran they could make her talk!! haha

    I just keep praying that God protect, and keep this little one safe from harm, and bring him home to his Daddy.

    I feel the same way Hadley. This little boy has really stolen my heart, too.

  35. Hadley permalink
    January 13, 2010 1:25 pm

    SPACELEY: A BIG AMEN TO YOU! I SO AGREE.

  36. Hadley permalink
    January 13, 2010 1:40 pm

    RENEE; WOW!! I just read the article about Craig Cherry being the Smith’s first cousin, and I am SHOCKED! The Smiths should BE IN JAIL! Good heavens, this PROVES they are involved, and I think it proves that they know where Gabriel is!! This is just unbelievable. I hope they put the Smiths in a rat infested, dark cell until they tell LE where Gabriel is! This is outrageous, and I hope NG quits “coddling” them. They need to be jailed ASAP! They are as guilty as the Mother in my opinion! I say JAIL THEM until they talk!

    Oh! I am SO ANGRY!

  37. Linda From New York permalink
    January 13, 2010 2:26 pm

    OMG I hope there is NOT a new breed of Casey Anthony’s! It is amazing there is seemingly another.
    BTW, I have been more of a reader than commenter here. Always enjoy reading at this site!

    Hi Linda!

  38. Hilde permalink
    January 13, 2010 2:59 pm

    Renee~~ I just read the Article You posted, it is very interesting indeed.
    I guess Investigators in this Case do have a Reason why the Smith’s are a Person/s of Interest. It seems like Tammi Smith comes up with an Excuse or Explanation for every Questions she is asked and she does that with a Smile.
    I must say there definitely is something fishy about that Couple. Law Enforcement has their Work cut out with this Case.
    Seems to me whoever has Gabriel should bring that Boy back as soon as possible
    if they won’t get in serious Trouble their selfs. Its been all over the News that Every One is looking for missing Gabriel, the only right thing to do for whoever knows anything about this Baby or who has him to bring him back and let LE make sure Baby Gabriel will be put with Someone who will keep him save
    if that is Logan, Gabriel’s Father so be it. JMO

  39. stephanie permalink
    January 13, 2010 4:06 pm

    Thank you for the link Renee…I don’t trust the Smith’s. They have done everything include helping Elizabeth hide Gabriel from Logan…He sued for custody because of neglect. Now they are playing the victims on tv..No I don’t trust them at all.
    Elizabeth also seems to have a quite a temper. I can’t remember exactly, but I believe she cut up Logan’s clothes and broke some windows. Logan has a DUI from 2004, but that is long before he became a father.
    I just pray they find an alive Gabriel and bring him home to his father.

  40. Mary permalink
    January 13, 2010 4:18 pm

    Has anyone seen Tammi’s fb? Here are some things I found….. I own the largest Colon Hydrotherapy clinic in America!!! They have a very nice BIG home.. Pics: Tammi has had several different looks, 3 older children, one pic w/ two small children that quotes: Me with 2 of my babies at the orphanage in Kenya, Africa. I can’t wait to go back! Another pic. in Africa that quotes: Me with three of the ladies I had just baptized outside of Nyrock, in Africa. I really don’t like to bash people, but some of this kinda strikes me wrong. It all could very well be possible, but it’s odd!!!! any thoughts????

  41. stephanie permalink
    January 13, 2010 6:00 pm

    Mary…Did you friend her? The other night she had over 1500 friends and within 2 days over 1700 friends. But, than someone told me she might play the different games like Mafia war and that is why so many…along with getting so many more within 4 days. I think i will go friend her now, lol

  42. stephanie permalink
    January 13, 2010 6:02 pm

    Wow…she already accepted me…less than a minute, lol

  43. Mary permalink
    January 13, 2010 6:46 pm

    yes.. she accepted me right away too..

  44. stephanie permalink
    January 13, 2010 7:38 pm

    Mary…Isn’t that weird? I mean it is real easy to make a page in no time for a missing child. Why would you let all of us strangers in there to see your personal info or your child? She also is answering questions on her fb.
    I am watching NG right now and I think Tammi is thriving of this attention. NG just asked what LE is telling her…They are not calling her back. Does she realize she is not running the show (meaning the investigation)??

  45. Mary permalink
    January 13, 2010 8:23 pm

    I also thought it was strange that she was answering ?’s on her fb..

    I would be concerned if LE wasn’t returning my calls!

    I hope and pray baby Gabriel is safe!
    I just don’t see someone keeping him and not turning him over to authorities.. too much time has gone by… There’s not even an amber alert is there?

  46. Mary permalink
    January 13, 2010 8:33 pm

    Even is she does have a GPA of 4.0 doesn’t mean she has common sense..obviously..Tammi!!

  47. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 13, 2010 10:11 pm

    Mary and Stephanie,

    I just friended her on fb. Waiting for a reply.

    Also responded to comments within the comment boxes.

  48. stephanie permalink
    January 14, 2010 2:34 am

    Mary…Very true

    Mystery…Has she accepted yet? I am going to go find your comments.

  49. Boston permalink
    January 14, 2010 7:49 am

    Good Morning Mystery-Yes, you’re definition of the terms is correct. Spacely had some very good points to make and that is what prompted my question. Could it be possible that the DA had information/evidence (and I think it would have had to be circumstantial*) prior to December 11, 2008 and that is what prompted charging her with Felony Murder and attaching the DP. We know that under the Florida rules of Criminal Procedure that they do not have to publish anything that would be detremental to their case stategy. Then again, perhaps it was only when they found the body did they have the opportunity to substantiate and prove that it was premeditated and that a homicide did in fact take place. Because the victim was so young even without a body the DA would have been forced to add the HACs.
    *Mystery I have never believed that George and Cindy Anthony were truthful when they were interviewed by Greta von Suseran in July/August 08. She asked them specifically when was the last time they saw Casey and Caylee and their answer did not ring true to me. It reminded me of Scott Peterson’s response to when he last saw laci alive and described what she was watching on tv, etc.
    George may have had no choice but to tell the Grand Jury about the smell of decomposition but did he tell the truth about the last time he saw his daughter? If he did in fact lie, and came forward with the truth later, than I would think that would be direct evidence relative to motive possibly or time of death. (sorry for going off topic)

  50. Renee permalink
    January 14, 2010 10:09 am

    .Startling new developments concerning “persons of interest” Jack and Tammi Smith in Gabriel Johnson disappearance!

    Travis Warford, biological father of Jack Smiths granddaughter Hannah claims grandfather Jack Smith stripped him of his parental rights without notifying him or his family and adopted his daughter. Travis claims he has been completely alienated from his biological daughter! Travis states, ” The Smiths falsified information stating they had in order to gain custody and have manipulated the system to adopt my little girl without contacting me or my family.”

    During the Baby Gabriel investigation, FBI searched the house of adoption specialists in Nashville, Janet Morris, and uncovered documents where Morris was challenged for allegedly stripping a father of his parental rights without properly notifying him. [Reported by CBS5 news Phoenix]

    Travis also states that he is afraid of Jack Smith due to being threatened by him and that Jack Smith also once tried to bribe him with $5,000.00 to pay for his divorce with the terms “that Travis would immediately leave town”.

    Travis also claims that he was jailed more than once for several bogus and fabricated “trumped up” charges.

    Travis found out his daughter was adopted by the Smiths through a search for Tammi Smith’s MySpace page where Tammi Smith posted pictures and wrote of her newly adopted child, “Hannah”.

    CBS5 news of Phoenix also reports that [Tammi Smith said her former husband abused her and after several years of fighting, she lost custody of her three daughters] Why did she lose custody of her three daughters if she was the one being abused for several years? Someone is not telling the truth and now the Smiths are saying Travis Warford is completely lying about what they have done to he and his daughter. The documents recently uncovered by the FBI clearly show Jack Smith’s “adoption specialist” was challenged for stripping Travis of his parental rights, now who is lying? Travis was stripped of his parental rights and inhumanely alienated from his daughter!!!! What is even worse is that this little girl was stripped of HER RIGHTS to her loving, caring, biological father!!!!

    Now there are two little children that we know of connected to the Smiths that are completely separated from their biological fathers. Logan McQueary, father of baby Gabriel was possibly going to be another victim of the Smiths and have his parental rights stripped from him and things went totally wrong and lets hope that Elizabeth Johnson is hiding Gabriel alive somewhere and with someone safe and that he will be found. The father Logan and his family need his son returned safely to them immediately!

    Travis Warford also has a child missing from him and his family and fortunately he knows the location of his daughter. There needs to be an investigation into the Smiths seemly shady actions and behavior and Travis’s daughters’ adoption. A young little girl needs her father!

    Any one who has information about the location of Baby Gabriel is requested to call the FBI immediately.

    http://framedfathers.blogspot.com/

  51. Boston permalink
    January 14, 2010 12:02 pm

    Renee-Thank you for your post. What would possess Nancy Grace and her producers not to vet the Smiths? Nancy could have had this information at her fingertips when Mr and Mrs Smith first appeared on her program. When Mark Klass hinted at their credibility why did Nancy turn her angst in his direction? Why were so many in LE both in Arizona and Texas absent from her show? I found that troubling. Now in the wake of this information this takes on a “new dimension”.
    Imagine, Mrs Smith a mother of three and never once mentioning anyone but her adoted daughter hannah. What a story.

  52. Mary permalink
    January 14, 2010 12:24 pm

    how do I find the comments??lol

  53. Boston permalink
    January 14, 2010 1:05 pm

    Mary-If you are looking for Renee’s link please click on this: http://www.kpho.com/news/22222086/detail.html

    Hope this helps. I do not really know how to help you find the comments.

  54. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 1:29 pm

    Hi Stephanie–She accepted within minutes last night.

  55. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 2:21 pm

    Boston–

    The prosecution offered Casey a limited immunity deal in Aug 08′ to try and get her to tell them if she murdered Caylee or if it was an accident. Of course, at that time she would have had to admit she knew Caylee was dead because it was not an absolute given that she was. I think the state felt pretty confident because of the circumstantial evidence they had that Caylee was dead, but nothing that could actually prove Casey did it without a body. Hence they wanted Casey to admit she knew Caylee was dead and how she died plus lead them to the body.

    http://www.bloggernews.net/117466

    In December 2008, right before they found Caylee’s body, the prosecution had decided they didn’t have enough circumstantial evidence according to the ‘aggravating factors for seeking the death penalty in the state of Florida’ and declared they would NOT be seeking the death penalty.

    https://itsamysterytome.wordpress.com/2008/12/05/no-death-penalty-for-casey-anthony/

    After Caylee’s body was found the defense began trying to block the prosecution from putting the death penalty back on the table without success, and in April 2009 the state filed a notice of intent to seek the death penalty because sufficient aggravating circumstances exist to justify the imposition of the death penalty." (her body was found and it was determined to be a homicide, etc.)

    https://itsamysterytome.wordpress.com/2009/04/13/the-death-penalty-is-back-on-the-table-for-casey-anthony/

    So, I don’t think they had enough evidence period that could have caused them to be able to legally seek the death penalty until after the body was discovered. They were just “fishing” when they offered Casey the limited immunity deal.

    Is there such a thing as direct evidence relative to motive? I don’t know!

  56. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 2:28 pm

    Renee

    Thanks for the link!

    That is unbelievable!!! Wow. Things are stacking up against the Smiths’. If they know where Gabriel is they better start talking. I wonder if they thought since they got away with it once they could bully Logan as well.

  57. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 2:31 pm

    Boston

    I agree with you!! NG may have gotten so caught up in her ratings that she didn’t want to risk the Smiths’ backing away from her show like the Anthonys’ did. I also think it’s unbelievable that the Smith’s don’t mention Tammi’s three other children. The fact that she lost her children would certainly explain why they were looking for unconventional ways to adopt.

  58. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 2:32 pm

    Mary

    Which comments??

  59. Renee permalink
    January 14, 2010 3:30 pm

    Boston,
    Nancy Grace is ignoring certain aspects of this case, or is pretending not to ‘notice’ certain things. To me that trnaslates into having the Smiths on her show over and over again so she can have a larger audience. If she starts to question them in a accusatory manner, they will not come on her show again. I wish she would stop doing that, but NG will be NG?

  60. Mary Jo permalink
    January 14, 2010 3:37 pm

    How do you find Tammi on fb? When I looked there are alot of Tammi Smith’s.

  61. Mary permalink
    January 14, 2010 3:50 pm

    Mary Jo…

    Tammi Peters Smith

  62. Mary permalink
    January 14, 2010 3:52 pm

    itsamysterytome permalink
    Mary and Stephanie,

    I just friended her on fb. Waiting for a reply.

    Also responded to comments within the comment boxes.

    **Were you talking about making comments on Tammi’s fb??**

  63. Mary Jo permalink
    January 14, 2010 3:59 pm

    Mary
    Mary Jo…

    Tammi Peters Smith
    ———————-
    Thanks Mary.

  64. Renee permalink
    January 14, 2010 4:21 pm

    does she talk about Baby Gabriel on fb? What is she saying to you guys? Will you show it here?

  65. stephanie permalink
    January 14, 2010 4:22 pm

    Hello Everyone…Thank you for the info Renee

    Mary…I was talking about the comments on Tammi’s wall. I posted this morning…I read many last night that bothered me. So this morning I posted they all need to remember Gabriel’s father Logan. Maybe LE wants the Smith’s to keep opening their mouths like they are?

    Would you all let a bunch of strangers on your personal fb?? I wouldn’t…I would set up a different FB…which she has no place doing anyhow because Gabriel is NOT her child. Not only that, imo she is thriving off Gabriel missing…she is LOVING this attention.
    I also sent a message to Logan..Just to let him know that he and Gabriel are in our prayers.

  66. stephanie permalink
    January 14, 2010 4:24 pm

    Here is my comment on her wall…She does talk on her wall.

    Lets not forget what Gabriel’s father is going through. Logan loves his son…Felt Gabriel was being neglected…did the right thing and filed for custody. Gabriel was stolen from Logan..Imagine what he is going through right now. A hole in his heart that will be there until he has Gabriel in his arms again. I pray Gab…riel is safe….and will be reunited with his father.

    here is Tammi’s response

    Believe me, I totally agree!!

  67. stephanie permalink
    January 14, 2010 5:12 pm

    Jack Smith was just on Prime News for a few minutes…they get their digs whenever they can. At the end he said no no we won’t ever be his parents. His dad has come forward now and he will be with him. Well it isn’t for me to say whether he will be with him or not…that is for the courts. They can’t stop getting digs in on him for the life of them. They were in the wrong NOT Logan. Logan didn’t just come forward he has been there the whole time, GRRRRR.

  68. Mary permalink
    January 14, 2010 5:45 pm

    sorry I got confused..lol

  69. Mary permalink
    January 14, 2010 5:54 pm

    I know Stephanie! I think they’re eating this media attention up… Tammi often comments about it on fb…Does Logan have a fb?

  70. stephanie permalink
    January 14, 2010 6:25 pm

    Logan has fb but is not as open with it, lol. His is all set private and I didn’t friend request him. I felt bad…felt funny about friend requesting him. So I just sent him a message. You can find him easy typing in his name…Gabriel’s picture is up

  71. Boston permalink
    January 14, 2010 7:45 pm

    Renee-Thanks for that link. I know I said that before but it bears repeating. Your update was also intriguing. This is going to turn out with more than Ms Elizabeth behind bars. If the Smith’s have anything to do with this case than they could be facing 2 of the same charges that Casey Anthony is presently facing: lying to LE and obstructing an investigation. I wish I could see NG but Georgetown is playing a Bball game and god forbid I interfere with that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Mystery-Thank you for your hard work. I almost feel bad about asking the questions. Is it possible for me to print your response out? If you say you would prefer that I not reproduce it I will not be offended. Just give me the word. Thank you for your great answer. Spacely probably would like to give me a dope slap for making you work so hard.

  72. Boston permalink
    January 14, 2010 7:49 pm

    When I read the posters responses all I can think of is the movie where Fred Astaire danced on all three walls. Walls? Who’s commenting on a wall. I suppose information can be written anywhere. Maybe it’s just graffetti.

  73. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 8:10 pm

    Mary

    sorry for the misunderstanding–what I meant by responding within the comment boxes was that I got behind here and responded to the comments on this particular post within the individual comment boxes.

  74. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 8:12 pm

    Renee-

    Yes, Tammi does talk about Gabriel on her wall in Facebook. She also has posted quite a few pictures of him taken with her family.

  75. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 8:23 pm

    Boston-

    You can print out whatever you want from here. I don’t mind at all–I also didn’t mind digging up the answer to your question! Anytime, girlfriend! 😀

    And I’m laughing at what you said about Fred Astaire dancing on the walls. Wasn’t that “Royal Wedding”? I love Fred Astaire!! A person’s Facebook page has a wall where people they have accepted as friends can write publicly. You probably already knew that though. I, on the other hand, had quite a time figuring facebook out. I had to get my kids involved!

  76. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 8:25 pm

    Stephanie–
    Good for you! (about your comment on Tammi’s wall) I haven’t commented there yet. It was late when I asked her to friend me, and I like you, was shocked that she accepted me!

  77. Mary permalink
    January 14, 2010 8:47 pm

    Omg!! Can’t believe the Smith’s weren’t on NG..
    A babysitter has come forward saying that she watched baby Gabriel while they were staying at the hotel… Hopefully we will find out more info soon.. I hope he is found alive . I don’t want this to end up being another horrible story like Caylee.

  78. Renee permalink
    January 14, 2010 8:54 pm

    Thanks for the information, stephanie. Wow, how strange is that!
    Thanks Boston, go go go go Georgetown?
    The Smiths are over the top. Attention seekers, mind players? Waiting on the second polygraph test and have you heard the latest? The mother had a babysitter in the hotel room.

  79. Renee permalink
    January 14, 2010 8:56 pm

    Good that the Smiths were not on NG. Now I can watch the re-run later without having to stomach them.

  80. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 9:15 pm

    A babysitter has been found? I missed NG tonight. I hope this doesn’t turn out like Caylee either, Mary.

  81. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 14, 2010 9:16 pm

    Renee–

    I hadn’t heard that they were actually being given a second polygraph.

    I sure hope that babysitter saw or heard something.

  82. ???MAND permalink
    January 14, 2010 11:05 pm

    According to the babysitter..she was called to babysit b/c E had an important appointment…the babysitter said she was dressed like she was going clubbing…however this was at 11:30AM…low rider tight jeans and a tight short midriff shirt and stilettos…what kiind of a meeting would one wear that to…a sexual appointment??? Maybe that’s why she had $500.00 when they arrested her in Miami…bought clothes and had her nails done…she was hooking her way across the country??

    The babysitter also said E was giving the baby Tylenol…she had told her that she had just gave him some but if he continued to cry to give him more to shut him up.
    It crossed my mind she could have over dosed him….I don’t think she gave him to anyone.

  83. Boston permalink
    January 15, 2010 7:34 am

    Mystery-I just loved that movie. BTW the camera work was so innovative at that time. He danced and the camera rotated. How he got his hands and arms around the light fixture will always amaze me. Okay. On to other things. Oh, FB I dont use it. I like email better.

    ___________________
    Saw NG at 10PMEST. Why do I always think that someone should have called the police? Why didn;t this lovely girl see the knife and get that child out of harms way? She was a kind hearted person with a lot of insight yet she never thought it was odd to go to a hotel to babysit yet saw a neglected child who might have been dehydrated and did nothing? The poor girl.

  84. Renee permalink
    January 15, 2010 7:59 am

    Search warrant served (Smiths)
    The Smith’s computer(s) might have more information about their involvement. I am sorry to say this, but I think the Baby is dead.

    http://www.abc15.com/content/news/southeastvalley/tempe/story/PD-searches-home-of-persons-of-interest-in-Tempe/xgsbK2cK80iD5ZWBC0ifjg.cspx

  85. Boston permalink
    January 15, 2010 11:14 am

    Oh, Renee-I feel so bad. I hope it’s not true. Thank you for the link.
    I am not surprised about the search warrant and I would anticipate an arrest soon. Don’t give up hope Renee. The Smith’s might turn out to be terrible liars and even malcontents of the highest order but maybe they know where the child is and eventually the hoax will be up and they come forward with the truth. If they are somehow involved in the disappearance of this darling child the probability of him being alive is still a possibility.

  86. Mary permalink
    January 15, 2010 11:22 am

    Renee-

    hmm… I just saw that posted on Tammi’s fb. I was wondering what was going on since she wasn’t in the media yesterday..

  87. Renee permalink
    January 15, 2010 11:42 am

    Boston, it is getting under my skin, this whole missing Baby case. What shocked me yesterday was the fact that the Baby was thin and not clean. I does not make any sense to give your Baby away to a couple and the Baby looks dirty and thin? Red flag to me. Poor litte guy. While is it nice to blog and share ideas and info., crimes can really bother ‘the normal’ person. But I still have a glimmer of hope.

  88. Renee permalink
    January 15, 2010 11:49 am

    while I’m at it, why not give the couple the baby clothes, too? E. cut them up or threw them away. And how convenient, they brought their own car seat for the Baby. Odd. And the only reason she got a Babysitter for the Baby is to keep him from screaming while she was gone (to earn $$$?)
    My gut feeling tells me that something very awful happened. Sorry.

  89. Renee permalink
    January 15, 2010 12:04 pm

    i just found this info.
    A blogger has the child? I hope so.

    http://www.azfamily.com/news/Police-putting-pressure-on-couple-in-Baby-Gabriel-case-81692197.html

  90. Renee permalink
    January 15, 2010 12:10 pm

    There’s an entry from a blogger named “Beth” on beckyhiggins.com from around the first of the year drawing a lot of speculation.

    The post reads: “I live in Wisconsin, but am currently in San Antonio. My husband and I are adopting a baby boy that was placed in out care January 1. I’ve decided to make our project life baby Gabriel.” Investigators are checking into this lead.

    Posted By: Jennifer SaucedoWoman Claims She Cared for Missing Baby
    Thursday, January 14 2010, 09:10 PM CST

  91. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 15, 2010 1:45 pm

    Renee

    Spacely posted that about the Wisconsin blogger under comments in another post.

    https://itsamysterytome.wordpress.com/2010/01/14/fbi-questioning-employees-of-company-that-certified-tammi-smith-as-a-colon-cleansing-practitioner-in-the-gabriel-johnson-case/#comments

    Thanks for re-posting it for anyone that didn’t see it. It’s the first comment. I found her questionable but I’m glad police are checking it out.

    I know what you mean about the toll it takes on “average” people that are discussing the disappearance of innocent babies. Gabriel has touched my heart as much or more than Caylee. Maybe it’s because I raised sons and have a grandson close to Gabriel’s age. I want more than anything for him to be found safe and sound.

    I really do hope the Smiths’ have something to do with his disappearance and that Elizabeth didn’t go off half cocked on her own. That would mean it’s possible that someone did take him and that they are taking care of him.

    Gabriel appeared healthy and robust when he disappeared, but if the recently
    discovered babysitter’s description of the little boy is to be believed, he was dirty, thin, and according to her, being subdued with baby tylenol. That doesn’t sound like anyone had been helping Elizabeth, does it?

  92. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 15, 2010 1:47 pm

    Hi Mand!

    I hope she didn’t overdose him. Elizabeth’s behavior sure makes me think of Casey Anthony. Hope I’m wrong.

  93. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 15, 2010 1:52 pm

    Boston

    I wondered why she didn’t alert authorities at the time and also why she waited til now to come forward. She appeared to be Hispanic and being that close to the border I wondered if she might be in this country illegally or something and was afraid.

    I love movies from the 30’s and 40’s-especially the musicals and Christmas movies.
    My all-time favorite star from that period was the child star, Margaret O’Brien.

  94. Boston permalink
    January 15, 2010 3:58 pm

    I really love Margaret O’Brien and so many more. I saw a fab movie today called Separate Lies. The novel was written by Nigel Blichin-oh, I think I am off on that but at any rate it wsa first class in every way. I know you would like it. I only saw the last half but it was just a solid movie. Filmed in England-near London. Just excellent-I am going to get the book from the library.

    Renee-I know you are so keen on figuring out this crime. I know exactly how you feel-it never had to come to this if the Smith’s were above board and not looking to adopt a child in all the wrong places. The idea that the young babysitter was Hispanic might be the reason why she didn;t call the police. I got the idea she drove quite a distance to babysit for just two hours. Maybe she just needed the money. Bless her heart for coming forward.

  95. Renee permalink
    January 15, 2010 5:26 pm

    Yes Boston, I am trying to make sense of it all. Mystery, oh, I was not aware of the first posting of the link mentioned above. Thanks.
    Hoping for a good ending.

  96. ???MAND permalink
    January 15, 2010 6:40 pm

    Hi Mystery…
    She has taken a page out of KCs play book…missing child..key word missing…as long as the child is missing there is no proof that she murdered him…everyone is looking for that adoptive parent…just like Zanny.
    It’s to bad they can’t give her an allotted amount of time to talk and tell LE where he is or they charge her with Murder…maybe she would tell where he is if she had to save her A$$.

    Hi Steph…..

  97. Boston permalink
    January 16, 2010 8:55 am

    Good morning Mand-She certainly took a page out of the Casey Anthony playbook. Her affect is similar and attitude is over the top relative to proper courtroom behavior. She may be “a straight A student” but she cannot connect the dots when it comes to understanding what she did and why she is being incarcerated for such serious crimes. Is she setting up a future defense? Do I hear “Not guilty by reason of insanity”?

  98. ???MAND permalink
    January 16, 2010 6:31 pm

    Good Evening Boston…
    I’m beginning to think the Smiths engineered this entire situation…Elizabeth is not smart enough. Go back 7 months to the first meeting at the airport..Gabriel would have been a month old…Tammi sees this woman with a month old baby crying…she talks for a short time and then asks the mother if she wanted to adopt the baby out?? Would you say this is normal??? Wouldn’t most people try and get the mother some medical assistance?? I can not believe Tammi did not speak to her again til about a month or so ago…then E. gets in touch with T. and they start the adoption proceedings. Tammi has an answer for everything…she says everything she thinks LE will be asking and is always very wordy with her stories and rambling and always blames LE for not calling her back and the same with the Poly…they had been asking for one for weeks.
    Now her cousins name as the possible father…she said she didn’t sign the paper then oh yes she forgot she had signed it…then goes into the long diatribe as to why and how she forgotten she had done so.
    Tammi was not counting on the Father..Logan…not agreeing…it’s possible E. said he would…and they were trying to do things without his knowledge.
    It also maybe possible that once she left and made the contact in TX. the Smiths didn’t want to know where the baby was so they could take the Poly and pass…I think Tammi did her homework…or she thinks she covered it all. I find it hard to believe E is a 4.o she is a very troubled young woman…Logan loves the baby and she has a need to be first…and that’s a form of rejection to E.

  99. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 16, 2010 8:51 pm

    Boston

    I’ll check out Separate Lies. Thanks.

  100. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 16, 2010 8:51 pm

    Renee

    I’m hoping for a good ending, too!

  101. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 16, 2010 8:53 pm

    Mand

    I so hope this doesn’t turn out the way Caylee did……

  102. ???MAND permalink
    January 16, 2010 11:41 pm

    The more I hear from Tammi the more I believe the baby is alive…if T.contacted an underground org.to meet up with E in TX.they would not need the car seat or the clothes..they would have a supply…and E said she had an important appointment when she had the babysitter that morning and was gone for only 2 hours at the most.
    E. made the stupid comments about killing the baby not knowing any better…she doesn’t seem to understand there could be major repercussions for making those sort of statements. She may have even thought it might help…that LE would no longer look for a live baby and she knew there would be no body so she would have nothing to worry about.
    If they could hide Gabriel it will buy time and like was said…he will change in appearance and could be placed for adoption under another name and probably in a more Northern location..I think Tammi has been working on this for quite awhile…I think they intend to pay E. in time…that being the original plan. Tammi is quite happy…she doesn’t act like she believes the baby could be dead. JMO..

  103. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 17, 2010 1:58 pm

    Mand
    The rumor mill is suggesting that Tammi and Jack Smith may be in the baby broker business–the colon-cleansing business is possibly a front. If that is the case, let’s hope LE finds something on the computers that would substantiate that kind of accusation. Either way–“selling babies is our business” or “we just wanted to adopt this little boy”–I can’t shake the feeling that Gabriel is alive, not dead. What scares me is that whoever might have him doesn’t appear to have any intentions of bringing him back no matter how much publicity the case gets.

    San Antonio is very close to the Mexican border. Gabriel could be out of the country by now.

  104. ???MAND permalink
    January 17, 2010 10:58 pm

    Mystery
    I so agree on who ever has baby Gabriel has no intention of returning him…they would have done so had Elizabeth’s story been true. I also agree with you that he could be in Mex. and if that be the case was out of the country by the night of the 27th…didn’t she say at one time she had driven 2hours south the morning of the 27th drove back and left town??? 2 hours south as I remember would put you on the boarder???

  105. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 18, 2010 9:42 pm

    Hi Mand

    I don’t remember reading where she said she had driven, but there’s no doubt in mind that when she left the babysitter with Gabriel she was making the arrangements for handing him off.

    You are right that San Antonio is about 2 hours from the border.

  106. ???MAND permalink
    January 19, 2010 12:58 am

    Mystery…
    I totally agree she got her next set of instructions the day she hired the babysitter…and I believe Tammi set it up that way…Tammi didn’t want to know where the meeting or hand off was to happen…that way if there were any problems she and Jack could pass a Poly…she asked for a Poly right away…and then didn’t pass..inconclusive is not passing.

  107. Missy Raper permalink
    January 30, 2010 1:59 pm

    I think it’s funny that it just so happens that the 2 sets of people that came to her rescue when she was crying just happened to be looking for a baby to adopt.

  108. itsamysterytome permalink*
    January 30, 2010 8:05 pm

    Missy,

    I don’t know about you, but I don’t believe in coincidences.

  109. Hazel permalink
    April 26, 2012 12:44 pm

    It takes one sick fuck to even lie about killing their own offspring. “Little blue body”? What the actual fuck? She is a sociopath, may she one day show an ounce of humanity, tell the truth about Gabriel, and promptly commit suicide.

  110. John permalink
    April 30, 2012 8:00 am

    I can’t comment on any of the particulars in this case, but I can say that Elizabeth Johnson is absolutely gorgeous. By far, the hottest criminal defendant I have ever seen.

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